Message posted by Jennifer Steves on 26 January 2006 at 6:17am - IP Logged
Just read Jim Dolemans comments and must say that just because they they are not "ultra optimistic" regarding Langley's re-opening, they should not be dismissed as "negative"! Is it wrong to look at this realistically? My father and brother have been involved in trying to get tracks either re-opened or trackst to STAY open, and the opposition out there is formidable. ESPECIALLY in western Canada! Whether this is due to the environmentalists out this way, or what, who knows , but it is NOT easy, and I think Doleman is just trying to be realistic! If you read through all the posts, you will see it turn into a discussion that Langley re-opening will negatively affect the track in Kent! They assume Langley is re-opening! Are we not getting ahead of ourselves??? Lets just say the civic politicians in Langley LOOK at the support out there for Langley to re-open. This will take maybe 3 to 5 years, minimum. Then there will be forums and open meetings from the public in Langley, in the area surrounding the track. This will take another few years. THEN, and only then, a decision will be made if there is a POSSIBILITY of allowing the track to re-open. THEN, and this is presuming a favourable response is forthcoming from the GVRD, the matter of how many races are allowed to occurr must be addressed. If it is anything less than 12 races a year, it is a waste of time. NOBODY, and I mean nobody will put up the large dollar amount needed to build a track if they are only allowed 12 races or less. Its just not financially viable. Any more races, such as the proper amount of 20-25 per season, will be HOTLY opposed by area residents. THIS IS NOT BEING NEGATIVE, IT IS BEING REALISTIC! People just dont want a ton of races happening near them, and all the traffic it brings, if they are not race fans! And no matter what anyone says about things being different now, it is still the NIMBYS (not in my back yards) that impede progress. I have seen this firsthand in various locales in Washington State, Vancouver Island, and throughout B.C. anywhere close to urban areas. And the housing developments that have encroached towards where Langley Speedway was (and is) will only make it harder. If you think people lived within earshot in the late 70's-early 80's , what do you think it is like now? I am sorry if this is all too negative , but it is REALITY. I more than anyone would like to see the sons and daughters of Gordy Hemrich, Chuck Byrd, Roy Blumenhagen, Stan Schmidt , Jack Cross, etc. roaring around the Langley oval again, but I just want people to be REALISTIC. This will probably not happen, as there are just too many obstacles. I have spoken to many of the people associated with the track in the 1970's and early 80's , and they say the same thing! In another part of the Fraser Valley, maybe. But in the same spot as where Langley was? As Jim Doleman said, not likely!! If this is too negative for anyone here, sorry, I lost my rose-coloured glasses!
J.S.
Message posted by jason white on 26 January 2006 at 11:09am - IP Logged
so what other tracks have "you" tried to re-open? you make it sound like you have done this forever. bud has stated they have some political backing and alot of support has been shown. we will not know until the day someone in power says "no". also, you dont think 12 races a year would make it? i think it would, you just have to promote it properly, and make sure your venue is generating $$$ with other activities like swap meets, car shows and concerts and such. now more than ever do we see car loads of kids dyeing on the streets from speed, this is one of the biggest arguements we have, and by the way alot of people still drag race down 16th it is a long stretch of road that basically goes by the old speedway. just be positive and it "could" happen! jason white p.s. if you dont think 12 races would cut it , maybe we should ask Dick boness to come up and run the track, he would make it work!!!
Message posted by Murray Jones on 26 January 2006 at 7:09pm - IP Logged
I, for one, have never had a pair of rose coloured glasses. If people that come on this forum want to express how difficult it will be, to ever get the track open again, go for it. But honestly, you are wasting my reading time. I know all this and more about all that can and will be put before us and others, to stop us from enjoying something we LOVE, in our own communities because it is noisy and dangerous. Grants are given by the government for Diving clubs to buy ships and planes that they can sink in the ocean just so they have something to look at. That's a dangerous sport, but I can't argue that it's quiet. I grew up in Tofino, so I know all about special interest groups. It's the same everywhere now. Just leave us to our dillusions and dreams and perhaps if enough people have the same dream, we can make it come true. Thanks for the reality check, now let me go back to my fantasy! Cheers!
Message posted by Steve Lengert 56 on 26 January 2006 at 10:47pm - IP Logged
Many positive things have already happened.Whether we race at Langley again or not we have already brought the speedway back to life.Lots of old photos have been dug up,stories are being told and old friendships rekindled.Some material has been turned over to the Langley Centenial Museum and hopefully something will be set up.There are positive things happening behind the scenes, and as Bud mentioned before businesses are willing to support.Yes there is a long way to go but we have nothing to lose.There is talk of a racecar show and get together later this year at the track,it is for rent for clubs and movie productions.Hmm i think i will become a movie producer and make a racing movie,anyone interested in playing a racecar driver?
Message posted by no_fenders on 27 January 2006 at 12:31am - IP Logged
Yup !!! Every Saturday night.. Is the lead role still open.. ???
Message posted by Murray Jones on 27 January 2006 at 12:55am - IP Logged
You bet, I'll play any role in that film! That would be a great movie. We can have cameos from some of the original guys! That would be cool! What a great idea! Cheers, Steve!
Message posted by Brian Pratt on 27 January 2006 at 3:50am - IP Logged
I suppose the initial posting on this forum -- "discuss your memories of Langley Speedway" -- keeps me coming back.
The discussion of whether Langley can, or can't, be opened, and how long it will take to determine either result is appropriate here as well.
I just looked at Tom Johnston's book, Sports Car Racing in Western Canada, and he lists 21 failed attempts to get tracks running in B.C., most from the 1980s and 1990s, most in the lower mainland area trying to replace Westwood, Langley and Mission. I think the SCCBC thanks their lucky stars that Mission Raceway Park allowed them to build something to use, and develop, after Mission got up and running again.
I also think that knowing what you're up against is vital. Has anyone gone into the GVRD archives and sought out all the meeting minutes, etc., concerning Langley Speedway and Campbell Valley Regional Park? I've stumbled across a few news items from over the years as well as a 1979 30 page document from the GVRD assessing what to do with the speedway. But I haven't gone much deeper than that. It would take time and effort that I feel, personally, I have to direct to other things that I've committed myself to at this point.
A number of years ago I looked at the Vancouver Parks Board minutes at the Vancouver Archives concerning the workings and ultimate demise of False Creek Speedway. One week it was open, the next it was closed. The guy who put up $3000 (1960 dollars) never got compensated. When I spoke with him he just chalked it up to experience.
If you don't go into this with a lot of knowledge of what has happened and be prepared ahead of time then a lot of time and energy will be wasted with the same result that occurred 20-25 years ago.
Bud might have the right approach forming a historical society and having it registered under the provincial societies act. That at least gets the idea of a speedway on the radar screen. Then the frigging hard work begins, and with no guaranteed results.
Sometimes I think I'd just rather carry on doing what I'm doing. And, guaranteed, there isn't enough time to do those things let alone start adding more.
Message posted by Ted Hargrove on 27 January 2006 at 5:59am - IP Logged
Jim Doleman and Jennifer Steves are being criticized for being realistic. Why is that so wrong? Are we all supposed to be like George Bush, and say "all will be fine, just be positive"? I have read all the posts here and it is getting downright silly. Concerts? To support a 12 race season? Is someone on crack here? I live 3 blocks from Nat Bailey stadium in Vancouver, and have FIRSTHAND knowledge of the power that complaints about noise bring. There were 2, count them, two, concerts outdoors at Nat Bailey approx. 10 years ago. Black Sabbath? Hardly. The Gypsy Kings, and another time, Steely Dan. These were not loud shows , were not at night, and the crowds werent unruly. Geuss what? A few people bitched about noise, and there have been NO concerts since. If whoever is trying to get Langley re-opened has someone as naive as whoever suggested concerts, would be smart to distance themselves from this person. This would be certain DEATH. Rightly or wrongly, concerts are viewed as loud, unruly, drug and alcohol riddled nightmares. I had a place in Penticton in 1990 when MC Hammer had an outdoor show in City Park. A riot ensued, and it has been VERY tough to get ANY permits for outdoor concerts since at any unregulated venues in BC. This is FACT, not opinion, so please dont say this is being negative. To mention concerts as a way to supplement auto races will alienate Langley residents, Langley council members, and the GVRD faster than promoting Mad Cow disease at the Cloverdale Fair. Believe it!!!! I read Jennifers comments and she is almost bang on. You need 20 races to make it work, ideally w/out curfews. With the inclement weather here, there HAS to be alternate dates, and fans like to know there is racing EVERY weekend in the summer. The financial points made are correct too, as it is MUCH more expensive to construct grandstands, annoucers towers, public restrooms today than in the 60's/70's. Just who is going to do this in a 8-10 race season? Swap meets, show-and-shines, and Easter egg hunts do NOT bring in that added revenue needed! You may HOPE they do, but they wont. If only 8-10 races are allowed, does anyone actually believe that those "spare weekends" where no races are scheduled will be allowed to be filled with things such as concerts?? No, it will be only that initial no., because the powers that be dont want the added noise, crowds, traffic, etc. Gordy Hemrich sold to Action Raceway at the end of 1979 because he learned, from talking extensively with other promoters in the Northwest , that if you dont have a 20 or more race schedule, you are screwed! Why does anyone think the 2006 era would be any different? We aint talking Nascar here! In closing, I think all the supporters should be grateful for comments such as Dolemans and Jennifers. They are not saying it SHOULDN"T happen, just that it is VERY difficult. Just why is being realistic so wrong? Those two make some darn good points, whether you like hearing them or not! I still cant get over that. Just like that comment about concerts, man, that one STILL has me shaking my head. Can you imagine: "Guns and Roses, with Slayer will open the facility in 2008 at the Speedway site".......yah, that would go over REAL well!!!!!
Message posted by rob paulson on 27 January 2006 at 7:48am - IP Logged
if the number of races it takes is 20 as you claim , i counted kent as having 14 they seem sucessfull....ooops i dropped my rose colored glasses have to run...keep up the greay work bud
Message posted by jason white on 27 January 2006 at 10:33am - IP Logged
who said anything about guns and roses? sun valley speedway has experimented with some concerts and comedians and it was somewhat successful. you are entiitled to your opinion and so am i. if you want to be part of this ressurection attempt be my guest, but dont come on here and tell me ( some one who is active in the canadian racing world )to go away . i think i have alot ot offer to this attempt. and i can say that because i have been to damn near every race track in the western states and in canada in my 33years . so say what you want , but the day steve lengert and i turn our late models at langley speedway will be great....positive positive positive, alot of people will read this and even people that dont want this to happen, and nay sayers will fuel there fire!!! have a nice day, see you at the races....wherever they are. cascar #21 jason white
Message posted by Web master on 27 January 2006 at 12:26pm - IP Logged
For you guys who are being "realistic" and wonder why people are getting upset at you... I think it's the tone of the comments with all question marks?????? and all the exclamation marks!!!!! AND ALL THE CAPITALIZATION OF KEY WORDS. All this comes across as condescending in a discussion group.
No one here ever said it was a done-deal or would even be easy. Bud Bussiere is not trumpeting the imminent re-opening of Langley. Everyone knows it's going to be an uphill battle. The blind hatred of racing by certain people is everywhere. Have a look at my article on the 1990 re-opening of the CNE Speedway and the crazy stuff that the locals came up with.
I think Bud is approaching this the right way - start out low-key and talk to people and get business and politicians on your side. The way most people approach this is to spend a bunch of time planning and then show up at the local council meeting from out of no where and announce their plans to open a new track. Then they wonder why they get shot down. Bud is gathering his support first and creating a buzz.
I wish the best of luck to Bud and his efforts. I'm out in Ontario so I'll probably never get to the track if it reopens but I would love to "un-ghost" the track on this web site.
Message posted by Brian Pratt on 27 January 2006 at 6:46pm - IP Logged
Open-air concerts can work. Deer Lake Park in Burnaby had the Black-Eyed Peas, Michael Buble, a blues festival and the Vancouver Symphony last summer. Of course, it was "bring your own seats" for the grass amphitheatre of the park.
Message posted by Murray Jones on 27 January 2006 at 7:10pm - IP Logged
No one said it was wrong to be realistic. You just missed the point. We have heard our share of your realistic views for years, whether it was in regards to getting the port mann twinned or the bridge built over to Maple Ridge. But hey, look, those very well could happen despite all your kind telling some dreamers to be realistic. I don't know about concerts, but Agassiz seems to run quite well as a non-profit society working on community owned property with only 13 race dates (14 if you count the rain date). I hate to say it, but you almost sound like one of "them", perhaps even one of the speedway's neighbours! LOL. Tell me I'm wrong. Say something positive, like good luck and here is my support! Cheers!
Message posted by Doug Morton O.T.R.A 75 on 27 January 2006 at 8:08pm - IP Logged
All this talk of how many dates and how to go about it, reminds me that we as racers and as fans of racing. Need to look out for those tracks still managing to still be open ,in these times when people ( and I use that term loosley ) can see fit to close down races like th vancouver Indy and tracks around north america each day. We have an abligation to the tracks running now as well as the future.I know of a few tracks that are slowly fealing pressure from those who feal that even though they came after tracks, they are far more important ! Sadly we have become a society that comforms to the few rather that the many. Bud knows he has my full support and I will help in anyway I can , and the tracks like Kent know that I will be there to support them as well . so get out tell your freinds tell your employer to support racing, and maybe with some luck and some very hard work we can have one more track to call home.
Message posted by Steve Lengert on 27 January 2006 at 8:33pm - IP Logged
Thank you web master.As far as restructure costs i am involved in construction and have already been offered support from some prominent people.That is the least of our problems.Chris Pooke a California race promotor made a deal with some unhappy neighbours years ago.On race night he would pick them up in a limo and treat them to dinner.We have alot more support and resources now, then we had years ago.
Message posted by bud on 27 January 2006 at 8:57pm - IP Logged
Thank you rod. We as fans and racers all suffer a degree of bitterness over the injustice that happened twenty years ago. The track shut down not because of noise and traffic but because a small group of wealthy people wanted campbell valley park for themselves. They lobbyed neighbours and elected officials until they got what they wanted. They could have shared park but thats not what they chose to do. Were all here because we care about that old nascar winston west track. There is an old brick wall around the park and were going to start taking it down a little at a time. They have spent twenty years supressing the history and the existance of langley speedway. We all know it was never a go kart track that could be a lie. Making langley speedway history and existance common knowledge is the last thing they want. thats where we begin. We will not be doing a face plant up against that brick wall. thats what they want. Have a look at campbell valley website and you will find theres lots we can do. one last thought for now Could it be possible that langley speedway is more of a heritage site than all the barns in bc put together? there certainly were more of us there. bud
Message posted by Murray Jones on 27 January 2006 at 9:43pm - IP Logged
Well said, Bud. :)
Message posted by Dustin Lengert on 28 January 2006 at 1:38am - IP Logged
I am completely behind the re opening of the langley track my dad used to bring me there and now I'm racing next year in street stock , i caught the bug just lie every othere racer in this discussion room, if only i could race in my hometown, i'll gladly volunteer to help with any work on cleaning and rebuilding the track, i'd love to turn laps around langley, just like my dad used to.
Street Stock #56
Message posted by Ross Burrows (Alberta) on 28 January 2006 at 8:53am - IP Logged
3 words.....Molson Indy Vancouver. That is why I left Vancouver, the bitching that went on cuz of that race, it was amazing. That race left for Edmonton last year not just cuz of the redevelopment of the area, but the constant complaints from area residents. Non stop complaining. Ditto the PNE. Have you been there lately? Totally cut up into pieces and downsized. Compared to 20 years ago it is nothing. In Calgary, at the Stampede, the complete opposite has happened, with it getting bigger each year. Dont kid yourself, at one time the PNE rivaled the Stampede, but not anymore. Why is this? The BC attitude of get rid of it, dont support it, downsize it....its pathetic, really. Edmonton has welcomed the Indy, Calgary totally supports the Stampede. On the coast, the complete opposite holds true. Face it, with the location the PNE has, it should be awesome. Views of the mountains, the harbour, its paradise. Calgary is barren flatland, but has made something out of nothing. Vancouver does nothing with something. It is all about ATTITUDE. Langley failed partly because of this. I cannot believe the Alberta spirit regarding things like this.....its amazing. Good luck to all who are trying to get the speedway opened again...you'll need it. Those naysers are only telling it like it is I feel. How much really has changed out there? And if the GVRD still own the lease, land, and/or rights, do you really think they will give it up? Not bloody likely. My advice would be to look for another area that is a bit farther out, away from horses, homes, and any other possible roadblocks to "fun". Its sad, back in the early 1970's I went to see races there at Langley...to not have them still is a tragedy. The last time I went to the PNE I could not believe the stuff that had disappeared...WHY? Just who is making these unpopular decisions? Probably the same jerks who closed down Langley/Action in the early 1980's.
Message posted by L. Fields on 28 January 2006 at 9:36am - IP Logged
Just stumbled on this site, and know nothing about auto racing, but can only say an absolute "yes" to the above comments regarding the PNE. Everyone I know quit going for the exact same reason, the slow death of attrition of the grounds. There certainly is some (evil?) force that wants to get rid of anything fun in these parts. Add to the list the White Rock sand castle competition, last seen in 1987, the Sea Festival,the aforementioned Molson Indy, the PNE parade (remember that?)...the list goes on and on. How about the Grizzlies? All that will be (is) left will be the Gay Pride parade, the Sun Run, and the fireworks, but I hear that is on the chopping block too in the near future due to , you got it, area resident complaints! (Sigh)
Message posted by Katana 56 on 28 January 2006 at 5:59pm - IP Logged
Burrows and Fields points of view are well spoken.The rest of BC is fun it is the lower mainland that seems to shut out the fun activites.Our Katana series is well received in Williams Lake,Penticton,Vernon,Agassiz and the island.Vancouver has been dubed the no fun city for a while now.
Message posted by rob paulson on 30 January 2006 at 7:47am - IP Logged
this is just a note and a thought for those on here who say this can't be done
ask yourself this-
would you go and watch or participate?
would you enjoy racing in langley?
wouldnt be great if a piece of bc's racing history could be re-born?
if you answered yes to any of these drop the negative aspect and get on the bandwagon and maybe something great can happen here . Bud wont be able to do this alone.
anything you need bud just contact me on my email.
you have great support for this idea coming from port kells
Message posted by leadfoot eh on 30 January 2006 at 8:00pm - IP Logged
Can any one please tell me how average joe public can help this cause, do we need to contact our local mla or get signatures from other unheard fans how can we really get the ball rolling. anyone anyone
Message posted by Murray Jones on 30 January 2006 at 9:29pm - IP Logged
Sounds like we need to get behind Bud!
Message posted by Tom Meadow on 30 January 2006 at 10:26pm - IP Logged
I'm behind Bud righ now, and a Molson and a Canadian, and a Heineken, and a ....................................!
Topic: Langley Speedway
